Episode Summary:

In honor of International Happiness Day, join me as I sit down with Rev. Jessica Van Roekel to explore what it really means to count it all joy. As we reflect on personal experiences and biblical examples, we’ll highlight the distinction between circumstantial happiness and the deep, steadfast joy that comes from trusting God through trials.

You’ll gain a deeper understanding of how joy can be a deliberate response to life’s challenges, cultivating faith and steadfastness. Whether you’re navigating hardship or seeking a renewed perspective, this conversation offers hope and encouragement to find joy in every circumstance.

International Day of Happiness aims to make people around the world realize the importance of happiness within their lives. This day encourages people to spread happiness through a small action. But what happens when actions don’t cut it, and the feeling of happiness lasts mere seconds? What do we do when the idea of happiness seems far off and impossible?

Quotables from the episode:

• I liken joy and happiness, the difference between that is that a river usually has a source. And A river can get filled up with mud and leaves and twigs and even beavers come along and build dams and so further on down the little stream, it's just dried up, rocky, dry bed. But if you follow that stream, you eventually come to the source and the source is where it just bubbles out. And that's how I liken happiness and joy is that joy is the source. My relationship with the Lord is my source of really life. It's my source of source of strength. It's my source of everything. The breath that I breathe comes from God and that is my joy. So, I can have these circumstances like postpartum where it felt like continue on with the analogy that streambed dried up. It's like the depression built this dam between the feelings of happiness and yet that joy, the source was still bubbling and still there.
• From a neuroscience perspective, happiness and joy engage the brain in distinct but overlapping ways. Both emotions activate reward systems in the brain, but their triggers, durations, and neural pathways differ significantly.
• Happiness is often a fleeting emotional state triggered by external stimuli or achievements, like eating a favorite meal, receiving a compliment, or reaching a goal.
• The brain's happiness response is typically short-lived, subsiding once the rewarding experience ends or the novelty wears off.
• Joy is a deeper, more enduring emotional state that often arises from intrinsic sources, such as gratitude, faith, or connection with others. Unlike happiness, it does not rely solely on external circumstances.
• Joy is more sustainable than happiness because it is less tied to transient external factors and more rooted in internal states like faith, gratitude, and meaningful relationships.
• Happiness primarily relies on external stimuli and rewards, triggering immediate but temporary dopamine release
• Joy emerges from internal processes and deeper reflections, engaging serotonin pathways and regions involved in emotional and existential meaning.
• Happiness is short-term, as the brain’s reward circuitry adapts quickly to pleasurable stimuli (a phenomenon called hedonic adaptation).
• Joy is longer-lasting, supported by neural circuits linked to emotional regulation, contentment, and resilience.
• Happiness can be disrupted by stress, as the brain's focus shifts to managing perceived threats.
• Joy can coexist with stress, as it often stems from a sense of purpose or faith that provides emotional resilience during trials.
• Happiness happens to us while joy happens within us—fruit of the Spirit, a choice, endures hardships/sufferings.
• Happiness is a reaction but joy is a practice and a behavior, deliberate and intentional.
• In the Bible, happiness appears less than 30 times but joy appears hundreds of times.
• Counting it all joy when we face trials means we:
  • experience God’s strength,
  • feel the power of faith,
  • hang on God’s powerful arm,
  • and witness God’s work.
• When we “count it all joy” God proves himself faithful to produce steadfastness in our hearts.

Scripture References:

• James 1:2-4, ESV “Count it all joy, my brothers, when you meet trials of various kinds, for you know that the testing of your faith produces steadfastness. And Let steadfastness have its full effect, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing.”
• Esther 8:16, NIV “For the Jews it was a time of happiness and joy, gladness and honor.”
• Proverbs 23:25, NLT “So give your father and mother joy! May she who gave you birth be happy.”
• Psalm 92:4, NET “For you, O Lord, have made me happy by your work. I will sing for joy because of what you have done.”
• Isaiah 52:7, ESV and NASB “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him who brings good news, who publishes peace, who brings good news of happiness, who publishes salvation, who says to Zion, “Your God reigns.”
• Psalm 32:1-2 NLT “Oh, what joy for those whose disobedience is forgiven, whose sin is put out of sight! Yes, what joy for those whose record the LORD has cleared of guilt, whose lives are lived in complete honesty!
• 2 Corinthians 12:10 That is why, for Christ’s sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

Recommended Resources:

• Reframing Rejection: How Looking Through a Different Lens Changes Everything By Jessica Van Roekel
• Sacred Scars: Resting in God’s Promise That Your Past Is Not Wasted by Dr. Michelle Bengtson
• The Hem of His Garment: Reaching Out To God When Pain Overwhelms by Dr. Michelle Bengtson, winner AWSA 2024 Golden Scroll Christian Living Book of the Year and the 2024 Christian Literary Awards Reader’s Choice Award in the Christian Living and Non-Fiction categories
• YouVersion 5-Day Devotional Reaching Out To God When Pain Overwhelms
• Today is Going to be a Good Day: 90 Promises from God to Start Your Day Off Right by Dr. Michelle Bengtson, AWSA Member of the Year, winner of the AWSA 2023 Inspirational Gift Book of the Year Award, the 2024 Christian Literary Awards Reader’s Choice Award in the Devotional category, the 2023 Christian Literary Awards Reader’s Choice Award in four categories, and the Christian Literary Awards Henri Award for Devotionals
• YouVersion Devotional, Today is Going to be a Good Day version 1
• YouVersion Devotional, Today is Going to be a Good Day version 2
• Revive & Thrive Women’s Online Conference
• Revive & Thrive Summit 2
• Trusting God through Cancer Summit 1
• Trusting God through Cancer Summit 2
• Breaking Anxiety’s Grip: How to Reclaim the Peace God Promises by Dr. Michelle Bengtson, winner of the AWSA 2020 Best Christian Living Book First Place, the first place winner for the Best Christian Living Book, the 2020 Carolina Christian Writer’s Conference Contest winner for nonfiction, and winner of the 2021 Christian Literary Award’s Reader’s Choice Award in all four categories for which it was nominated (Non-Fiction Victorious Living, Christian Living Day By Day, Inspirational Breaking Free and Testimonial Justified by Grace categories.)
• YouVersion Bible Reading Plan for Breaking Anxiety’s Grip
• Breaking Anxiety’s Grip Free Study Guide
• Free PDF Resource: How to Fight Fearful/Anxious Thoughts and Win
• Hope Prevails: Insights from a Doctor’s Personal Journey Through Depression by Dr. Michelle Bengtson, winner of the Christian Literary Award Henri and Reader’s Choice Award
• Hope Prevails Bible Study by Dr. Michelle Bengtson, winner of the Christian Literary Award Reader’s Choice Award
• Free Webinar: Help for When You’re Feeling Blue

Social Media Links for Host and Guest:

Connect with Jessica Van Roekel:

Website / Instagram / Facebook

For more hope, stay connected with Dr. Bengtson at:

Order Book Sacred Scars / Order Book The Hem of His Garment / Order Book Today is Going to be a Good Day / Order Book Breaking Anxiety’s Grip / Order Book Hope Prevails / Website / Blog / Facebook / Twitter (@DrMBengtson) / LinkedIn / Instagram / Pinterest / YouTube / Podcast on Apple

Co-Host:

Jessica Van Roekel is a worship leader, speaker, and writer who believes that through Jesus, personal histories don’t need to define the present or determine the future. She inspires, encourages, and equips others to look at life through the lenses of hope, trust, and God’s transforming grace. Jessica lives in rural Iowa surrounded by wide open spaces which remind her of God’s expansive love. She loves fun earrings, good coffee, and connecting with others.

Hosted By: Dr. Michelle Bengtson

Audio Technical Support: Bryce Bengtson

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